Electric Car Makers: Oregon Wants You

Ted KulongoskiNick Chambers Oregon Gov. Ted Kulongoski behind the wheel of Nissan’s prototype electric vehicle. Mr. Kulongoski wants to make Oregon the go-to state for electric vehicle production.

In a flurry of electric vehicle activity, three back-to-back announcements this week have placed a spotlight on Oregon’s plans to be the friendliest state in the nation in which to build, sell and buy electric cars.

At a press event on Monday, Oregon’s governor, Ted Kulongoski, was talking up Nissan’s previously announced partnership with the state. According to Nissan, the company plans to introduce its upcoming electric car in Oregon in late 2010.

Not to be outdone, on Tuesday the Norwegian electric car startup, Think, was in Portland being wooed by the state as one of 8 potential places to site their first car manufacturing facility in the United States.

Although Think has been plagued by bad financial news recently, the company’s North American C.E.O., Richard Canny, said he was confident that Think would find the funding to pull through its current financial situation and added, “We believe Oregon could be a really good place for Think to do business.”

Finally, in a first-of-its-kind partnership in the United States, Mitsubishi announced a strategic alliance with Oregon to develop an electric car charging infrastructure in the state. And in a deal similar to the one already in place between Oregon and Nissan, Mitsubishi said it also plans to release its upcoming electric vehicle models the state.

(Last year Oregon had also aggressively negotiated with the Chinese carmaker, BYD, to manufacture its line of plug-in hybrids in the state for sale in the U.S.)

So why has Oregon become a hotbed of activity for electric vehicles all of a sudden? Governor Kulongoski is currently pushing a plan before the state legislature to cut some hefty tax breaks for electric vehicle manufacturers who choose to come to Oregon, as well as provide huge tax credits to purchasers of electric cars.

“My vision has always been for Oregonians to be able to drive from Astoria to Ontario and from Portland to Ashland emission free,” Mr. Kulongoski said. “Families could be making that drive in an emission-free vehicle manufactured in Oregon by Oregonians.”

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It amazes me that in the vast debate about electric cars world wide including here in Norway, no one ever mention the fact that the batteries in such cars need replacement in no more than five years.
So imagine a million electric cars on US roads which all need to change these batteries in say 2015. The huge hill of used batteries represents a major problem with the toxic acid and lead inside. To deal with this major special waste problem has to my knowledge never ever been brought to the attention of the readers of any paper around the world. Batteries are highly special toxic waste and cannot be dropped on the average dump site, so who is going to pay to get rid of this problem? Furthermore, changing the battery pack on say a Toyota Prius often costs a fortune, at least in most European countries, so such cars better be VERY cheap, but they’re not.
To convince me and the general public about purchasing an electric car, there are a lot of challenges to overcome. One thing is for sure; – electric cars bring down the air pollution, but they sure create another waste pollution problem. So why don’t journalist ever write the full story?

Kaare (#1),

Your concerns are well taken. In the U.S. at least, the recycling infrastructure for the well-established lead-acid batteries is robust. In the U.S. lead-acid batteries have a far better recycling rate than even aluminum bottles — over 90% of lead-acid batteries are recycled. There are companies that are reinventing the lead-acid battery to make it more competitive with lithium-ion and nickel metal hydride in terms of storage capacity versus weight, durability, and cold weather performance. If these companies are ultimately successful and can convince EV manufacturers to ditch lithuim ion, we could depend on the already robust recycling program. Firefly Energy is the most prominent of these companies.

Even so, most next gen EV manufacturers are focused on lithium ion (and to a lesser extent NiMH) as the core technology to power their cars. It is very expensive to reclaim the metal in a lithium-ion or nickel metal hydride battery and the recycling infrastructure for these types of batteries is in its infancy compared to lead-acid. More often than not, the “recycling” of NiMH or lithium-ion batteries involves shipping them off to places like China, where their fate is truly unknown. Still, the toxicity of NiMH and lithium-ion is significantly less than that of lead-acid, which is why the regulators have been relatively slow in dealing with the problem.

However, your claims about batteries needing replacement every five years are dubious at best. Many of the first Prius hybrids that were released are still running strong on their NiMH batteries after 100,000+ miles.

And, if you consider lifetime costs of owning an EV versus owning a traditional internal combustion car, even if the initial purchase price of the EV is much more than your combustion car and you have to replace a battery for $4,000 after 7-10 years, the EV still costs less to operate. See the below link for a more in depth discussion of this topic.

Shameless self plugs here. I’ve written several posts about these exact topics:

Firefly Energy:
//gas2.org/2008/07/01/who-might-win-mccains-battery-competition-part-i-firefly/

True cost to own of EVs (especially read through the comments on this one:
//gas2.org/2009/03/27/is-the-tesla-model-s-really-for-the-rest-of-us-gallery/

Kaare-

Lithium Ion batteries do not contain lead (unless it is in solder connections) and do not contain acid. None of the new electric cars are planning to use old-tech lead acid batteries. Current batteries in new Toyota hybridsare ~$3000 if they need to be replaced. The new Lithium Ion batteries are expected to last the life of the car (depending on how they are used), are easily recycled and do not contain the heavy metals of previous technologies. Your main concerns have already been addressed.

The big problems now is how to create a battery that can charge rapidly and infrastructure to charge them. Range is another issue if electric cars are expected to be adopted by the average American and not just used as city cars.

The electric car is only part of the story in Portland. Wind, hydro, DC transmission lines, and smart grid electronics are also Portland strengths. Read more in this blog post: //www.gridinsight.com/2009/04/portlandvancouver-as-altenergy-hub.html

Nothing pollutes more than the tailpipe of a internal combustion engine car. Even if you charge your EV with electricity made from coal fired generators you reduce your car’s pollution by half. If you charge with solar, is way less. We need to stop BURNING fuel in our cars. Batteries last a lot longer now and are recycled. Gasoline is burnt up and gone forever into the atmosphere and into our lungs. Once you only have to replace your cars battery say every 5 – 15 years and not buy gas anymore, (from people who hate us), you will never want to go back to stopping at the gas station say every 5 – 15 days just because you haven’t switched to the best and latest technology. And with EV maintenance you are less exposed to being ripped off buy the ICE car repairman.

I make, convert and drive EV’s and have for 13 yrs.

Lead batts are around 98% recycled. In EV’s they do need replacing in about 5 yrs if done right. But that cost in a built as an EV is much less than an ICE’s costs by about 1/2.

In most conversions cost is about the same because of needless weight.

Li is now the same cost of AGM, sealed lead batteries and soon will be as cheap as and replace lead batteries in EV’s because they weight 1/3-1/4 the weight/cap.

Chevron owns the NiMH patents and have not allowed EV size batts to be built. Li though have many different types, weigh less and more power. Now add much cheaper materials and NiMH is now obsolete. But it would have made EV’s better for 10 yrs until now had they been available.

A very low cost EV is taking a golf cart transaxle or whole GC rear/seat and weld, ect a MC front end, frame, title to it, change the batteries from 6vdc to 12vdc to double the voltage and use larger dia VW Rabbit tires and you can have a nice 1- 3 person MC trike that goes 45-55mph and 50+ mile range.

Many EV groups online for more info or google EV clubs or EV racing and follow the website’s links. Only listen to people who drive EV’s everyday for advice as many myths abound about them.

I did mine for $150 but I have a lot of stuff I got for free lying around. But most could build it for under $1k and mine gets the equivalent of 600mpg fuel cost wise. YMMV. I even tow a trailer for lumber, ect with mine. Used Cell phone tower battery takeouts are inexpensive and available about everywhere if you call around. Not good for large EV’s but great for light ones.

I have an EV all composite body/chassis that goes 80mph and 100+ mile range I’d like to put into production so I think I’ll give Oregon a call. Portland is already an EV center and has been for 15 yrs..

Obama’s “Social Democratic” dream will be further unveiled after the failure of GM and Chrysler is certain and on the books. Next: a carbon tax. Next: We will see massive government investment in high speed intercity rail, complete with elaborate terminals, on a scale only comparable to Hitler’s architectural fantasies, with total computer control and co-ordination, and millions of short haul battery commuters to go terminal to home, or shopping. This “Total Transportation System” is designed to keep America running when the OPEC countries start admitting empty wells, a certainty the date of which is a CIA secret, determined from space technologies ahead of OPEC themselves! but must be very prematurely soon, indicated by government prerogatives taken! Air travel will be limited to extremely expensive intercontinental and military flights to conserve oil, and nuclear developments will be for military purposes only for national security. The big threat will come from escalating military forces build up in China and India, and we will realize we lack the manpower to run our extensive and growing military complex as it is! The small electric will be king and batteries a valuable commodity, so valuable in fact, they will have to be wielded in to prevent theft by the Solar, Wind, Wave, Tidal, folks for their home installations! Recycling of dead cells will become a big spin-off industry just like re-built motors are today, and all will be well in America, slower, but off of oil, and better, more sustainable – you know, more “Granola”

The driver has a killer stash! Anyway, you should check out the documentary Who Killed the Electric Car?

Also, there so much pollution created in the process of manufacturing the batteries for these cars, that it’s making reverse progress towards the goal of being more “green”.

Me too taking one new project. This is the first project for this world.the project is ADVANCED ELECTRIC CAR.may be after 6 month surely i finished my project.if you don’t mind if you know one for helping my project please contact me…

Jared – that’s a one time emission and certainly better than what would come out of a gas powered car over its lifetime.
I also wrote an article about cars and what’s good and not good. //www.buzzgrub.biz/

New Toshiba Battery Recharges In 90 Seconds, Faster Than Gas Pump

Witamy to się zmieni już niedługo samochód elektryczny dostanie nowe urządzenie które pozwoli tym samochodom na nieograniczony zasięgu odwrócimy się od baterii wodoru czy kondensatorów będzie to nowy kierunek rozwoju